[Malcolm Armsteen]

Why is Ireland like a pair of trousers?


James Joyce

[MisterMuncher]

There's a Muff at the top?


(But yeah, I picked those two specifically because they had been renamed Queenstown and Kingstown in the 1800s and promptly switched back)

[Youngian]

Are all of these pronounced Siobhan?

Cobh - "Cove"
Dun Laoghaire - "Dun Leary" or "Dun Lira" (as in the old Italian currency)
Laois - "Leash" or "Leesh" (an anarchic English spelling is "Leix", pronounced the same way)
Offaly - "Offaly" (pronounced like "awfully" but with emphasis on the "O")

As for girls names, just wait until you meet Méabh, Aoífe, Naimh, Róis, Órfhlaith, Grainne, Aoibhinn, Cobhlaith, Áine, Caoimhe, Brid, Eilish, Deirbhile, Máiréad etc. and yes I know at least one woman or girl from each name mentioned. In the past I used to coach girls Gaelic football, filling in the team sheets was great fun!

In Wales there’s a gripe about growing bilingual teaching being a middle class affectation primarily driven to open doors for the kids in cushy public sector jobs. As most bus drivers in Holland speak fluent English, the moaners could always up their game.
Saw a programme about growing numbers of Protestants learning Irish in NI. None were there as a political gesture but just thought it would be useful to learn.

[Spoonman]

There's a Muff at the top?


(But yeah, I picked those two specifically because they had been renamed Queenstown and Kingstown in the 1800s and promptly switched back)

Ditto Laois & Offaly being Queens County & Kings County, switched back/renamed after partition.

Irish boys names OTOH don't tend to strike as much fear into those whom aren't familiar with Irish pronunciation, at least in that such names aren't as widespread as their female counterparts - names like Liam, Dara/Darragh, Cillian, Ciaran, Eoin, Sean etc. can have a stab taken at for someone who's never read it before & they likely wouldn't be too far away especially as many of these names have spread beyond Irish shores and so have heard it before they read it. Tadhg, Odhrán, Dáithí & Proinsias OTOH can cause a bit of tongue twisting that likely won't be close to right first time, but for whatever reason since the 90's it seems to have been fashionable in Ireland to give girls "local" names that an anglophone would never have a hope of guessing its spelling until it's written or spelled out to them that the girl's previous generation of mothers, aunts etc. didn't have to the same prominence. The more complex the spelling, maybe down to local Irish language dialects for the names, the better it appeared. Never caught on to the same extent with boys names in the same period for whatever reason, though I've noticed it growing more in recent years.

In the end, to English-only speakers it's not much different to names rooted in Welsh or (Scottish) Gaelic languages as well as a few others native to these isles. And its not as if the English language itself hasn't got many cases of words where the letters don't correspond to how it's pronounced.

[Malcolm Armsteen]

Because there's Athy in it.

Portrait of the artist

[Spoonman]

In Wales there’s a gripe about growing bilingual teaching being a middle class affectation primarily driven to open doors for the kids in cushy public sector jobs. As most bus drivers in Holland speak fluent English, the moaners could always up their game.
Saw a programme about growing numbers of Protestants learning Irish in NI. None were there as a political gesture but just thought it would be useful to learn.

Bib: There's a similar sentiment at least in Dublin about the Irish language being more of a "middle-class pastime" with them more likely to adopt "complex" Irish names etc. for their children though unlike in Wales, to pass the Leaving Certificate in schools in the Republic you have to pass a minimum level of Irish to be awarded your qualification. Given that most civil service posts in the state require some competence in the Irish language, I can see a parallel. Outside of "The Pale" however, there isn't really a class divide in Irish language use or name adoption - more common in Gaeltacht areas as well as trendy urban places like Galway, but that's about it.

And yes, there have been some outreach Irish language classes being given in what would be places whose demographics lean Protestant or Unionist. Probably the best known example would be Linda Ervine, wife of the late former UVF member & PUP leader David Ervine, whom has been an Irish language advocate now for a good few years as well as more recently helping set up the East Belfast GAA club.

[Youngian]

That’s a no then from the British Restoration Party (me neither and look even worse than they sound)

[Youngian]

This chestnut is trotted out every for people as stupid as Andrea Jenkyns to get worked up about. St George has always been a bit of a damp squib with the English ever since the Normans imposed him. And there were Catholic and Protestant gripes about him during the Reformation.

Andrea Jenkyns says “lefty luvvies” are to blame for the decline in popularity for St George’s Day across the UK.

The Conservative MP says her constituency of Morley and Outwood is a bastion of the occasion with “amazing” traditions being upheld, but admits the same cannot be said for the rest of the country.

Speaking to Dan Wootton on GB News, she hit out at “the Remainer type” who are keen to do down English traditions and values.

She said: “I think it comes back down to the lefty luvvies who are always proud to be European, yet they call us little Englanders.
https://www.gbnews.com/politics/tory-mp ... ay-decline

[Andy McDandy]

Does she say what she wants to see in terms of recognition of the day? Because AFAICS suggestions of traditional English celebratory activities tend to be dismissed as being a bit sad and nerdy (maypoles, Morris dancing etc), and cutting to the chase and offering up getting drunk and having a fight doesn't get many laughs.

[Youngian]

Doesn’t Andrea know the cult of saints is frivolous Papist idolatry? Ask your DUP pals they’ll explain it to you.

[davidjay]

It's always struck me that we went from "Why don't we celebrate St George's Day?" to "You're not allowed to celebrate St George's Day" without ever celebrating St George's Day.

[Bones McCoy]

Does she say what she wants to see in terms of recognition of the day? Because AFAICS suggestions of traditional English celebratory activities tend to be dismissed as being a bit sad and nerdy (maypoles, Morris dancing etc), and cutting to the chase and offering up getting drunk and having a fight doesn't get many laughs.

I did some searching.

The best traditions (and these are town or more often village traditions) are a papier mache dragon fighting with George in cable knit chainmail.
All good for a laugh, but it occupies something like five minutes of showtime.

[Malcolm Armsteen]

I'd pay to see a recreation of the martyrdom of St Edmund (our proper patron saint) featuring any Tory minister you care to select for the eponymous rôle.

[Andy McDandy]

It's always struck me that we went from "Why don't we celebrate St George's Day?" to "You're not allowed to celebrate St George's Day" without ever celebrating St George's Day.

In Nottingham in 2016, April 23rd was a Saturday, and in the main square there were medieval themed events, and Shakespeare themed ones too. Very jolly and enjoyed by almost everyone.

The local branch of the EDL were out in force. Not taking part, but holed up in pubs jeering at BAME people walking around, and doing Nazi salutes at the police.

[davidjay]

It's always struck me that we went from "Why don't we celebrate St George's Day?" to "You're not allowed to celebrate St George's Day" without ever celebrating St George's Day.

In Nottingham in 2016, April 23rd was a Saturday, and in the main square there were medieval themed events, and Shakespeare themed ones too. Very jolly and enjoyed by almost everyone.

The local branch of the EDL were out in force. Not taking part, but holed up in pubs jeering at BAME people walking around, and doing Nazi salutes at the police.

Like the parade in Stone Cross, West Bromwich. Non-political, organised by English Democrats election candidates, featuring a Loyalist flute band and with Nick Griffin getting mobbed.

[Youngian]

There’s just no pleasing some people. Asked one of these characters why Sadiq’s poll ratings are higher than his two predecessors at the same point in the electoral cycle? He’s been shipping in Muslims to London, apparently.

[Spoonman]

I didn't think this was enough to start a "Meanwhile in the Netherlands" thread, but I guess it shows that to be a darling to modern right-wing/alt-right you really have to be a grade A+ cunt.

"Racism, anti-Semitism, misogyny, homophobia”: Former FvD workers describe leader Baudet

Former employees of FvD described the atmosphere at the far-right party as toxic, intimidating, and unsafe. According to them, party leader Thierry Baudet regularly confronted them with racism, anti-Semitism, misogyny, and homophobia. “That literally destroyed me as a human being,” one former employee told AD.

The newspaper spoke to fourteen former FvD members, three other involved people, and studied several hundred pages of correspondence, including emails, diary entries, and text messages. It got the image of a work environment where people who criticized the party received massive fines, people received unsolicited porn, and employees regularly suffered harassment...

...Several people mentioned an incident in May 2020, after several members of the FvD’s youth department JFVD were expelled against Baudet’s will for racist and anti-Semitic messages. According to them, Baudet raged against the employee who supervised the investigation, throwing several empty bottles at them that evening. “That was absolutely intimidating, unsafe, toxic, everything.”

https://nltimes.nl/2023/04/11/racism-an ... der-baudet

[Youngian]

Speaking of the Netherlands, a policy to buy up a small amount of farms as the most practical way to cut nitrate pollution levels, has sparked a global conspiracy followed by the stupidest people I’ve ever come across.
Their proposition is that it’s a world government conspiracy (Jews) to dislocate the indigenous population and build more houses for immigrants. And something about the WEF wants to force feed us with insects. And starve us.

[RedSparrows]

For an anti-globalist lot, they sure do like their general, global and utterly banal tropes. The same shit, different country.

The rejoinder would be, naturally, 'well, the globalists are doing the same shit everywhere!!!'

To which one might think 'as they're not, it's curious your instinctive move is to generalise everything to the point of erasing the very significance of that which you're defending'

[Youngian]

Did I hear he fucked off to South Africa instead of sticking around to reap the Brexit glory?