[kreuzberger]

I add my thoughts and condolences to those of others during these testing times, Mister Jay. I know those competing forces of blessed relief and bottomless loss as the new day dawn's. Testing times, indeed.

[Tubby Isaacs]

It wouldn't happen for 2-4 years. In the meantime, it's your job to prepare for it. If you're not prepared to do that, you need to resign. Actually, do that anyway.

You can't win with this stuff. If it saves money, it's bad and if costs money it's also bad.

[Abernathy]

Precisely. The NHS might have no cash to fund assisted deaths right now, but as I understand it there is a four year lead time built into the legislation that will certainly not mean funding being immediately taken away from other parts of the service . The effect of the legislation on overall NHS funding is something that it is Streeting's responsibility as Health Secretary to accommodate .

I think you're right to suggest that if Streeting feels so strongly that he cannot do so, it is incumbent on him to resign his post.

Otherwise, he is simply making mischief in the face of the will of parliament.

[Tubby Isaacs]

I don't think there's a 4 year period in the legislation, but that's the estimate of how long it will take. Something that the "improve palliative care first" people strangely didn't mention.

He pissed Starmer off before with his excess opining on assisted death. Wouldn't bet against his arse heading out of the door if he carries on like this.

[Abernathy]

I don't think there's a 4 year period in the legislation, but that's the estimate of how long it will take. Something that the "improve palliative care first" people strangely didn't mention.

My mistake, apologies. But it does seem to be the case that it will be at least four years before the first legally assisted death can go ahead.

He pissed Starmer off before with his excess opining on assisted death. Wouldn't bet against his arse heading out of the door if he carries on like this.

And I'd not object to that if it happens.

In the meantime, a short bill (or just an explicit instruction) to protect those who assist and accompany their terminally ill loved ones to Dignitas from prosecution might be a useful measure in the context of the Leadbeater bill's passage onto the statute book.

[Tubby Isaacs]

Starmer as DPP stopped those prosecutions. Not just of loved ones, but also of a doctor who accompanied 5 different people to Dignitas.

I'd like to hear from Tom Tugendhat and some of the others if they want this doctor prosecuted. Say what you like about Jacob Rees Mogg, but he'd probably say clearly that he did.

[Tubby Isaacs]

From The Guardian's version of the Streeting story.

The impact assessment produced by the government on the bill suggested that panels set up to approve procedures would cost about £2,000 a day, adding up to between £900,000 and £3.6m over a 10-year period. The total cost of running the panels – and employing a dedicated commissioner – would be between £10.9m and £13.6m a year.

However, the assessment estimated that the bill would ultimately cut end-of-life care costs by millions, with a central estimate that 2,183 people would use the service by its 10th year.

This leaves out the positive value in people seeing their loved ones avoid agonizing, prolonged deaths. Hard to put a monetary value on that, but there would likely be one.

[lambswool]

By one of the coincidences that make our world such an interesting place my mum finally slipped away a few hours after the vote. Anyone who voted against it should have had to spend the last few months visiting her. She was thankfully peaceful over the past few days but before that we had months of mental torture for her and a lot of angst for those of us who saw her fading.

I’ve only just seen this, David. My sincere condolences to you and your family.